Author Topic: Ligatures in Word 2010  (Read 4803 times)

Ken Krugh

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Ligatures in Word 2010
« on: 2013-05-09, 10:32:42 »
We have a font that we're developing in FontLab in which the standard fi and fl ligatures will not work in Word 2010. Unfortunately I'm not sure of the origin of the original font, but even if I remove the other features, add just a standard liga feature with the fi and fl substitution, it doesn't work. The ligatures for our newly generated font DO work in InDesign (CS3 and CS6) and CorelDraw so it seems to be a Word 2010 issue.

In trying to figure out what is going on I've been investigating other fonts, some whose ligs work in Word 2010 and some whose do NOT. One font whose ligatures do NOT work is Times New Roman (again, the ligs DO work in other programs). Opening that in Font Lab I don't see that the fi and fl are in the liga feature at all. Nor have I been able to find either glyph name or Unicode in an exported features file.

Does anyone know what might be causing this in Word 2010 or how the other programs might be getting the ligatures from the Times New Roman?

Thanks for any clues anyone can offer.

Thanks,
Ken

Lorna

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #1 on: 2013-05-09, 13:59:28 »
My understanding is that a font must have a dsig (digital signature) in it in order for the latin ligatures (such as fi) to work in Word 2010.

That doesn't explain why TNR fi doesn't work in Word 2010 since I'm fairly certain TNR has a dsig! The further issue is that you have to go to the fonts menu, click on Advanced, select "all ligatures" and the "fi" ligature should turn on.
Lorna

Ken Krugh

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #2 on: 2013-05-09, 14:50:51 »
Hmm, I knew about the DSIG thing with the kerning, maybe I'll check that out with the ligs also!!

When using the fonts that DO work setting the "Ligatures" to "Standard Only" does the trick.

I'll let you know f I find anything!

Thanks a bunch for responding!

Lorna

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #3 on: 2013-05-09, 15:54:16 »
I think it's dependent on how it's implemented. In Calibri "fi" is in a liga and in TNR it is in a dlig.
Lorna

Ken Krugh

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #4 on: 2013-05-09, 16:07:23 »
I tried to figure that out but wasn't able to see it. Do you mind telling me how you know its in the dsig?

Thanks again!

Lorna

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #5 on: 2013-05-09, 16:15:49 »
it's in dlig, not dsig. Confusing. I looked at the two fonts in DTL OTMaster which allows you to see the different lookups in the features.
Lorna

Ken Krugh

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #6 on: 2013-05-09, 16:21:20 »
Yeah, sorry, meant dlig.

So, I guess FontLab doesn't decompile everything when the TNR TTF is opened?

I'll give adding the dsig a try.

Thanks again (and again, and again...)

Ken Krugh

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #7 on: 2013-05-11, 23:46:37 »
BRILLIANT! The problem is, indeed, the absence of a DSIG table. Windows apparently doesn't recognize ANY OT features without the presence of the DSIG.

This page http://typophile.com/node/90383 at 24 Feb 2012 — 4:14pm has this nice little except taken from Microsoft page  http://www.microsoft.com/typography/developers/opentype/detail.htm.

At the beginning of this section, I referred to the DSIG table as a 'required' table. In fact, a digital signature is not required in the same sense that the CMAP and many other tables are required simply for the font to work. A font without a DSIG table will work, but it will not be recognized as an OpenType font by the Windows operating system. Because the OpenType format is an extension of the TrueType format, and most of the new tables are optional, Windows makes a distinction between the two formats based solely on the presence or absence of a DSIG table. A font with a DSIG table will be recorded in the Windows font folder as an OpenType font and presented with the OpenType icon.

Adding the DSIG shown on this page using ttx from the Adobe Font Dev Kit to decompile, add the DSIG XML and recompiling made the ligs work.

Thanks again for the input,
 Ken

theFontfitter

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #8 on: 2014-10-21, 12:49:55 »
Ken, perhaps you could explain in a step-by-step way just how this is done...

"decompile, add the DSIG XML and recompiling made the ligs work"

As someone new to what part TTX, XML plays (I don't know anything about them) - I use FontLab on Mac but need to insert dummy DSIG into OpenType-TT fonts. I have Windows machine for testing fonts which has TTX app on it but FontLab.

Thomas Phinney (FontLab)

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Re: Ligatures in Word 2010
« Reply #9 on: 2014-10-24, 11:32:21 »
See this article for more info on TTX, why you might want to use it, and how to install it and related pieces.
http://store.fontlab.com/index.php?option=com_fss&view=kb&Itemid=431&kbartid=13